Phill 0:05
I've had the honor of calling this guest a friend since the only way to watch anime was by renting them from pine hollow video, or getting the bootleg VHS tapes from basement tea shops in Chinatown. I remember being introduced to him in the ninth grade as the guy who knew kung fu and that could draw a mad good. Over the past two and a half decades, our adventures spanned from vampires to Dark Elves to dealing with the police to raves to music collaborations and a lot more. I would like to welcome a hero I call by the first name Adam.
Adam 0:43
Hey, man. That was awesome.
Phill 0:46
What's going on dude?
Adam 0:48
Wait, wait, what did we- what happened with the police?
Phill 0:52
Oh man, just just police be addicted everyone I dislocated my shoulder and- in Mike's backyard in the cops came and the cop was like, "Oh, I'll put I'll pop back and for you."
Adam 1:03
Oh my god that's right.
Phill 1:05
And then when I went back to visit and the cops pulled us over and like you showed him your license and through that shit in the grass.
Adam 1:15
That happened to me a bunch of times, man, with them throwing my license. For some reason cops like to be like, "Yo Let me see license I'll go get that shit."
Phill 1:23
Maybe it's that they think is a fucking shiruken in or something.
Adam 1:26
They just throw it and they just want to see me go chase it like a fucking dog.
Phill 1:31
Fucking assholes, man.
Adam 1:33
Yeah, I got abused. We got abused, bro.
Phill 1:38
Defund the police.
Phill 1:41
But alright, man. Yeah, dude. Yeah, man thank you for doing this, dude. You know, you're like, you know, you're like the first person that I wanted to interview for this just because we always are talking on the Marco Polo app, and, you know, always sharing ideas, especially, we were like talking about, like the umwelt and stuff and that was what kind of like, you know, got, you know, the gears turning in my head to do something. So, yeah, number one Thank you, man for, you know, for just the engaging me over the, over the years, you know, to really think a lot.
Adam 2:25
I appreciate it, man. And I thank you because, you know, we can only have those conversations, unless you're having them by yourself, which I do sometimes in my own head. But it's really great to have another person in the real world that you can bounce these ideas off of, and you've always been that for me. I mean, even when we were young, and I was making, you know, world building, making stories and stuff like that you were someone who always listened to what I was creating seriously because you've always remembered everything that I've worked on and have been able to reflect back on me on those things. So I appreciate that a lot.
Phill 3:01
Thanks, man. Thanks, man back at you, man. So yeah, dude. Yeah. So I guess we could just kind of just start with the beginning like I met you, as I said, like in ninth grade at the ninth grade center. And I knew that you did kung fu which is awesome. I think we- remember we had- we were- I think we started we were trying to like a like a real fight club like our own UFC. I don't remember that shit.
Adam 3:28
Yeah, I think I do.
Phill 3:30
And, like, we try to get all the kids that knew some kind of martial art whatever together to fight in classrooms before homeroom or some shit. It never happened.
Adam 3:39
Jesus Christ. I'm glad it never happened.
Adam 3:42
Yes, for sure. I definitely would have got my back- my spine broken because I'm the smallest person of all of our friend group. And so of course, you know, let's have a fucking Fight Club. And then Jeff has no control over himself and then I break my spine, right? That's what happens.
Phill 4:00
Yes, luckily, it never came to fruition but um, but yeah man also, you know, you also drew really well and like I think- I don't know how it is now I mean maybe you have like an insight to you know, teenage life now being a dad and stuff but I think like back then like drawing was like such a like a dope skill like if you can draw or tag or whatever like you just you just got like you know mad people giving you props and stuff, but um, yeah, man so like, what got you into martial arts? What got you into drawing and stuff? Yeah, you know, so like, kind of like before we met whatever. Yeah, man, like, Have you always been an artistic person or?
Adam 4:46
I think so. I think that I remember when I was little. We went to go see. Ninja Turtles the movie
Adam 5:01
And I felt so inspired and I think there was a couple of movies that around that time that I saw that inspired me that I didn't know what to do with the feelings that I had of inspiration or curiosity. So I know another one was what was a movie? Indiana Jones. So it was Indiana Jones, it was Ninja Turtles, and maybe one or two others like probably Thundercats, the cartoon, a couple of things that just I didn't know after I finished watching them. It's not like I could say, "Oh, that was amazing. I really love that" and then I go move on to something else. I felt like I had to do something. So I felt like tasked with doing something like, "What do I do? I don't know what to do." So the first thing I started to do was draw and I guess with a little bit of encouragement from maybe my mom or something said, this is really good. I thought that I could just keep doing it. And so I started making these little booklets that were stories of whatever character I was- usually it was a character that was already made, you know, Ninja Turtles or Indiana Jones. I remember I had Indiana Jones Jr. So I had like this young Indiana Jones that had adventures and I would staple the papers together and then I would make a little pocket in the front of the book where you could put a map. So I put me do a map, and then I put that up in that. And, and that was like, a project. And so I did a project and I felt good about the project and it felt like a through line from the movie to my real life. So I was including my imagination with this thing that I saw that inspired me and I felt that I had joined it somehow and I think that I got really addicted to it. To the not just the connection with the source of inspiration, but also the state of just working on some working on a project everyday having a couple hours to, to get in that flow state. I didn't know what it was at the time, of course, just being, you know, concentrating on on a project. I loved being in that zone. You know, we're thinking about that.
Phill 7:26
Wow, that's, that's awesome, man. So like you, you've just been, like, just on this creativity to for a long, long time, man, just, you know, kind of getting this kind of, I guess it's almost like an urge, right? This is like how you kind of dealt with this kind of feeling of wanting to connect to wanting to to like expand on things that you've been interested in.
Adam 7:52
Yeah, and I never really felt that way towards I never wanted to just be around a bunch of people. You know, I never really wanted to go outside and hang out with friends were exploring the world I kind of had an opposite curiosity, I wanted to pull something out from the inside of my consciousness or my own imagination. And when I realized that I had something there, it was more rewarding than almost the outside world. So I spent so many hours just by myself working on stuff.
Phill 8:23
Wow. And this is this is like so like Ninja Turtles come out like 1990 I mean that- I remember, man, it came out- yeah, reason I know because that it came out on my birthday in 1990. March 30, 1990. I never forget that. I was a huge Ninja Turtles fan and and just you mentioned the Ninja Turtles. I've totally forgot that we both went to the Brentwood library to do that drawing thing when we were kids.
Adam 8:54
I don't remember that. I might have I remember. I moved to Brentwood in 93"
Phill 8:58
Yeah. So it would have been around then.
Adam 9:01
Yeah, maybe it could be. It could be
Phill 9:03
Yeah, okay. It might have been a fever dream or something.
Adam 9:06
No, it could be, I mean, I don't remember a lot of stuff, bro. Like, there's so many things that I have forgotten. And I realized that I could just rely on other people to remember certain things because my brain has just, like shitted it out so many gigs of information to make room for new shit.
Adam 9:35
I don't rely on myself at all.
Phill 9:38
Yeah, man. Yeah, I guess you can hit up your mom or something like, yo, did we go to the Brentwood library?
Adam 9:44
She would definetly remember , I'm gonna ask her.
Phill 9:46
So either, you know it happened or I'm losing my mind. I'm starting to make up shit.
Adam 9:53
I'm okay with that consensus reality. We could just say that it happened.
Phill 10:00
All right, yeah. So you said, Yeah, you moved to Brentwood in 93. So yeah, man house. So how was that move? That's a pretty I think a tough time to move, right?
Adam 10:15
Yeah, it was, like a teenager, I was really depressed. I was really depressed because I was coming from the city. You know, I was coming from Brooklyn/Queens border. And I know that I had a hard time making friends when I was a kid. And I think joining martial arts at a young age I, at some point, I finally began to make some friends, I think, and I must have been about 13. And I started making friends. And then we moved, and I lost those friends because they were all part of the karate school that we went to together. We were in, you know, part of a young junior, competitive fighting team and it felt good to be a part of that. But then we moved and coming to Brentwood I felt like I had to start all over again. So it was bad for me at that.
Phill 11:12
And you used to play basketball, didn't you?
Adam 11:14
I did. Yeah. I hate that.
Phill 11:16
Yeah. Oh really okay.
Adam 11:19
My dad just made me do that. You know what I mean? And I didn't want to.
Phill 11:23
Yeah, yeah, man, that that makes a lot of sense. Yeah, 'cause, I think later on, I guess, you know, if fast you forward a little bit. Yeah. Like, we spent lots of time you know, like in your room like, you know, talking about like world building and stuff. And yeah, kind of, I kind of grew out of sports. Like later in my teens as well. So yeah, man. So you said that you were creating these these like, kind of comic books, these kind of projects. You kind of enjoyed, you know, being kind of being alone and, you know, kind of doing all this world building and stuff and you know adding to like, it's like not fanfiction, exactly but you know, kind of creating stories with like pre-existing characters and everything. So yeah, like was that like kind of the did they like influenced like, you know, your like your art style or like the way that you approached storytelling and stuff because I think later on you would, you know, go on to do a lot of creating?
Adam 12:28
Yeah, I mean it definitely was the beginning of my own world building. I know that shortly after shortly after all of those things, I started playing Nintendo and so video games of course started to influence my my art and my storytelling. I started to develop a style of drawing I guess, and it was comparable I often got compared from very early age, my style to Amano the guy that does the character design for the Final Fantasy series. And of course, I was a big fan of Final Fantasy as well. All of these elements started coming together and then watching a lot of anime as a kid. So there is so there was these elements of like RPG, you know, role playing games, fantasy, characters, character driven things, developing worlds developing mythologies, which is the things that I enjoyed from from the movies and the cartoons, and the video games that I was watching. Like, for example, Thundercats, the whole lore behind the Thundercats and the lore behind that sword. And then
Phill 13:45
Yeah, it's mad deep, man.
Adam 13:46
Transforming sword. Yeah, it's super deep and it's stuck with me and I remember, you know, playing RPGs where there'd be maps like just sprawling maps and you know that there are these territories, and you can explore them and as you explore them you learn about different cultures and I just wanted to create that I wanted to create my own world. And so from- I guess up starting from about 14 that's when I started drawing and writing, you know, my own stories and coming up with my own my own stuff.
Phill 14:23
Wow, man. Yeah, man. Yeah, it's so cool. Like, you know, hearing just about like that, like, kind of that journey in itself it's us it's almost like a, like a character arc as well like- and a lot of it was similar with me, man. You know? I was just drawn to it. I don't know why. But it was something about- I think you you kind of nailed it. Something about like this kind of this lore, right? This kind of something that is, you know, bigger than just the surface. You know, like If you play like the game like bad dudes on Nintendo–– remember that game Bad Dudes? Right? Like, you know, like, it was just these two dudes that beat people up and it was fun. But then, you know, I remember like a friend of mine, my friend Greg, you know, lent me his brother's copy of Final Fantasy. And then it was like the warriors of flight and these crystals. And it was just like, "Yo, like, this is like 100 times better than bad dudes, man." This is like this whole thing that this whole story that you're uncovering, you know what I mean?
Adam 15:32
Yeah, and I think, yeah, I'm sorry. Um, yeah, I think that that's the draw to it. The- what you said the other layers, there was something else beyond the first layer. And it's like that with me with Tolkien. It's like that with me with Lovecraft all of these these writers or video game developers or series/movies that have something else that happened, the and- but that's not what the story is about the story is set in a world that has taken place already that you could explore further if you want to.
Phill 16:12
That's awesome, man. That's that's cool, man and yeah in a kind of thinking made that kind of connected us because we had like that little group of dudes like the Dragon Kutters and stuff.
Adam 16:24
Yeah, I think were all into the same stuff, and yeah, we spent that summer- one summer, watching Lodoss Wars. I dunno what summer it was 96 or 97 or something like that.
Phill 16:36
Yeah.
Adam 16:36
And it was, it just resonated with me in in not just the lore, not just the anime stuff, but I think that I was drawn to those things for similar reasons. I will only speak for myself but I know that there was a certain idealism in my heart in a way, in my imagination, there's a certain kind of romanticism about life that I felt life was missing, you know, and I sought it out in my real life. And I sought it- and of course, I found it more often in my imagination in these works of art that allowed you to go on these adventures and explore a world and open up an entire unfolding narrative of lore. And the colors that were used to illustrate these worlds, the art, you know, whether it was a movie or it was an anime or comics or anything like that, manga, there's just a style that allows you to get lost in in in like a romantic and romantic in the sense of, you know, the the idealism. And we didn't have that, you know, we were we come back to real life and in real life we're in in these families that are torn apart by addiction and alcoholism and misogyny and our- the colonialism that sort of our development generationally, like Puerto Rican, Jamaican, African, you know, Cuban, people, immigrants. And we're just, you know, we're not the most, I guess, how could you say this, like, the most popular guys in high school, kind of like nerdy and off to the side so there was a lot of stuff that was definitely not ideal about our developmental time. And I think that I was attracted to certain creative styles, even music because we did that together too. And and that type of stuff opened up a world to me that I could shape in my own idealistic image, you know, I could tell this story, or I could be part of a story that I did have me in a place of being in control and a hero or at least make my heroes the way I thought that they should be, rather than what the world sort of, kind of like, enforces on us.
Phill 19:15
Yeah. Yeah, man, that's Yeah, man. Thanks for sharing all that, man. That kind of explained our experience to a tee. Yeah, it was a, it was a form of you know, it was a form of escapism. It was a way for us to, as you said, like gain control of, you know, of something, right? Because, you know, definitely, there were, you know, moments, especially in a growing up in in Brentwood where, or just, you know, particular family environments that were kind of out of control a little bit. We weren't able to do anything about it. So we had to kind of retreat in our own kind of, I guess, fantasy world, right or our own kind of, you know, way of finding, like, an anchor or something. And it was cool that we kind of had each other in a way, you know, to, like, escape together in like these shared worlds of, you know, whether it be video games or you know, like, movies or books, whatever. Yeah, it's dope, man. I never really never really thought about it too much. You know, it was it was more than just, oh, this anime is cool. Or this video game is fun. It was kind of like, this is my escape, man. This is kind of like therapeutic for me. You know what I mean? Have you know making these you know, these comic books and stuff? And we all did it. You know, we all will you know, part of our group and everything. We all kind of do that and then music I think later on, even today is a way that we still can do that. But thanks to you, thanks for sharing. So, alright, man. So let's um, let's kind of fast forward into Yeah 'cause we have so much we have we've done so much together.
Phill 21:04
Yeah.
Phill 21:05
Either either together or we were like doing the similar things like we were like parallel in a lot of our things so I guess some if we can just talk about a little bit media class yeah so I think that is when you and I really got close was through making like, you know, I guess movies and stuff and something that you even did after high school. So yeah man I'm what got you into that media class like, because I joined because I liked I liked somebody who was taking the class. I liked the girl who was in the class. I did some stalker stuff. Yeah yeah Jackie she knows .
Adam 21:50
Yeah. You made a song called "Why?"
Phill 21:57
The cringe man. The cringe is real.
Adam 21:59
You were you were you were an emo guy, man for a little bit.
Phill 22:04
Yeah.
Adam 22:05
And it was amazing. It was amazing.
Phill 22:09
Completely and totally embarrassing. But uh, but yeah, man. But you know, it turned out that there was two different media classes. And I got put in the class with you. And it was probably the best thing that could ever ever have happened to me, man. So yeah, man like what-
Adam 22:24
It was a huge part of, I'd say that that class probably changed the trajectory of my life, I think. And I remember when I went into high school, I was in ROTC and the teacher hit me with a stick or something like that. And I was just like, I don't want to be in this class anymore. And so I got out of the- finagled my way out of it. And then they were like, you have to take something so I took media, I just didn't know what else to take. So I took that And when I went in there, I was like, "Oh, this is a totally different kind of class. There's all this equipment." It's kind of open ended, I'd had no idea what we'd be doing. But I met you there and you were really cool. And Annie and a couple and Erinn and a couple of people who, I don't know, we're just different than the people that I've had known up till the moving to Brentwood. And we started working on these little video projects and that's when my love of making films and editing and sort of art directing audio visual experience began with you, basically.
Phill 23:42
Yeah, man. I just remember like we, we just clicked, man. Remember we did- I think the first project we did together was Tiger Bennett's.
Adam 23:50
Yeah, Tiger Bennett's Super Shaolin Karate Dojo, which is so stupid, because it's a dojo, right, which is Japanese is karate which is Korean, I would imagine. I mean, unless you're talking about, you know, Japanese styles of karate, yeah, whatever. But yeah, like then it's like super super Shaolin. So it was like, Shaolin, which is Chinese. So it was- ugh I just didn't know what to do with my love of Asian culture at that time. So I just- it was all over the place.
Phill 24:19
Yeah, yeah.
Adam 24:21
I was so stupid. It's so stupid.
Phill 24:24
But um, you know, it was- I think it was just um, it was just like wow, like we all kind of were like these kind of, I don't know, man where it came from, you know, I guess you know, at the time, there was like that show. Like, something powers or something I'll cut it in.
Phill 24:55
but I remember it was like it was like these fake fights of different fighting styles or something. I think that's what inspired- but and then we did some other projects that were all ninja-based, man, because I think games like Tenchu
Adam 25:35
Tenchu and of course like movies like Ninja Scroll.
Adam 25:49
I just thought fancied myself some kind of a ninja and then of course (oh God) and so so even in college, you know, I would just do these projects sort of like ninjitsu answers to kung fu flicks and we- and there were actually some of them were pretty, pretty damn good. Like we got a bunch of people together who knew martial arts, everybody was totally into it. The fight scenes were killer. The editing was really good. The music was great. And I think we were a little ahead of our time when it came to some of that stuff. 'cause this is like 96/97
Phill 26:28
Yeah, man. I wish we wish we had YouTube back then then maybe would have-
Adam 26:33
Yeah, this was just on VHS tape.
Phill 26:37
Do you have any idea why you were so into, you know, just kind of Asian culture? I mean, I I have my own theory, but um, yeah, like, do you have any any reason?
Adam 26:51
Definitely because of them. The martial arts. I mean, I I know that. You know, I I started martial arts when I was five. I got my black belt when I was 10. So, by the time I came out to Brentwood I was a second degree black belt. And then I was starting Shaolin Kung Fu and then I was learning Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. And I felt I felt empowered by martial arts. I was always a pretty scrawny kid. So just the fact that I had some kind of understanding of martial arts. Hold on a second this thing is definetly pass by and be really loud. So I'm gonna, like, move away from the window. I'm in Brooklyn, obviously. So this types of noise, so I can't I can't even I could, like hide in the bathroom and you could still hear that. I just loved the idea of being a scrawny kid. That was kind of tough. And then my toughness sort of came from training. And so when I connected with different types of anime or you know, just media, just Japanese media, there was an element of, obviously it is a continuation of the sort of Eastern- this Eastern philosophy of honor, like making yourself stronger, making yourself better, focusing your talent, of sort of internalizing your emotions to a certain degree. You know, every protagonist that you can imagine and in a lot of that early, manga and anime is someone who's going through something internally, but they don't show it very often on the outside. But what they do show on the outside is like a mastery of some kind of skill that a lot of people don't have. And that inspired me a lot. So I think I started going further and further into the realm of exploring any type of Asian- any culture outside of where we were at, you know, and that was another form of escapism for me, I think.
Phill 29:18
Yeah, man. Yeah, I definitely can relate. Yeah, just I kind of felt like, um, as you know, you mentioned, you know, we have like, Caribbean roots, to, you know, who we are, you know, and I always, I don't know why, but I always kind of envisioned it's really weird, but I always kind of envisioned like, Japan, and like Asia in general, like this kind of just how like, different it was, it was, I don't know closer to my roots was really weird. Then just like typical American stuff, you know, like European stuff, you know, like, it was just it was because I didn't want to, you know, not to get too deep into it. But yeah, I didn't want to conform to like, you know, regular things I wanted to like, find something else. But at the time, there was no, there was no Wikipedia, no internet, you know, like, nothing- I couldn't learn more about, you know, Puerto Rico or Jamaica- even Jamaica kind of have like the stigma of like, you know, like weed or whatever, but I knew that wasn't the case. But there was nowhere for you to find it. So I just kind of gravitated to this kind of Asian thing that had a deep history. And you know what I mean? Like, yeah, so I think I was trying to find, you know, something else.
Adam 30:45
Yeah, I couldn't identify with white culture. I mean, I knew that, uh, I wasn't, quote unquote, American. I knew that I wasn't white. So I didn't feel welcome in my own country and what I perceived to be my own country's culture, because I didn't you know, I didn't know anything about culture at that time and of course, being from within Latin American culture I didn't understand it like I understand it now, you know. I didn't understand that, you know, we're a mix of colonialist-settlers from Spain and Taíno natives and African slaves. I didn't, I didn't know that. And I couldn't embrace any of those things because No, none of those values were explicit in my culture, they were just sort of taken for granted. And of course, when you take something for granted, you know, you can you can step right over it without seeing the value in it, which I did for sure in the beginning of my life with my own culture, and then I didn't feel part of my current culture. So for sure, I felt this personal connection with Asian culture from a very early age, starting with martial arts and carrying through all the way to what kind of media I consumed what kind of art I gravitated towards, you know, manga and anime and sticking with all of these different martial arts schools and although the people who gravitated to those things as well.
Phill 32:16
Yeah, definitely. Yeah. thinking thinking back. Yeah, that kind of makes a lot of sense. But alright man we've have been talking for about 30 minutes. So yeah, man, let's kind of fast forward, man. I know we kind of spoke about a little bit about, like, life after high school, but um, yeah, man, were there any like pinnacle moments in high school that you would say, you know, propelled you in any particular direction. I think a lot of- like me, I went my- I've tried to major in film, which was a huge mistake and ended up dropping out.
Adam 32:54
I did the same thing.
Phill 32:56
So, okay, so you know, let's just set set the tone: finishing high school, you know, none of us come from, you know, particularly wealthy families but we were I think we all kind of decided that we had to go to college, rather than you know, not. Yeah. So like, What made you pursue university because, you know, I dunno if you want to- you can share it or you don't have to but you got into a pretty good school.
Adam 33:21
I didn't know what I wanted to do. I think I just sort of came out of my shell through that media class. At the last moment, you know, and I and I became more confident in myself, just before it was time to go to college, and I had no idea, you know, where people were, were, were sort of looking at what they wanted to do with their life. I was just looking at me and saying, "Oh, this is who I am" and understanding who I could possibly be while everybody else, kind of not everybody else, but a lot of other people seem to have gotten that out of the way and they're ready to move on to a career. I wasn't ready for that. But Because I would be the only person in my family to go to college, I was sort of pressured into just going, just go. So my film school at SVA was- I got accepted in there. And I think it was kind of just me trying to continue that media class. And it was just a continuation of that media class, for me, just experimenting and developing, but for no other reason, but to explore myself, but it was too expensive of a school to explore myself at. And that's just like, you know, I could do that for free somewhere else. So I dropped out of there. And then I went to Suffolk for theater. And that was just me continuing to come out of my shell. It was just all of my college experience in the beginning, up until recently, recently it's different, but back at that time when I was, you know, 18, 19, 20 it was me just coming out of my shell and into the world that I had been avoiding for so long. So I didn't really know what I was doing. I was just sort of performing, literally performing, performing music performing on stage acting, performing in in the art direction through whatever multimedia projects I was working on.
Music 35:17
Phill 36:47
Yo, what's up man? my bad.
Adam 36:49
Yeah, it's all good I dunno what happened.
Phill 36:51
It's The Elder Gods fucking with us. I think you left off like this. Talking about going to theater and like kind of that was how like how college eas helping you find yourself or whatever,
Adam 37:06
®ight? Yeah, I didn't know what I was doing, you know and after I graduated with an associates in theater my family kind of like fell apart and I lost my house and, you know, my mom lost her house so I didn't have a place to live so that kind of- my life became an exploration at that point of just trying to survive and the art became my therapy at the time where I was just trying to survive you know, I wasn't I was not trying to make a living off of art. I couldn't, I couldn't even make a living with a regular job. So around the time that I finished my associates degree, and I actually did pretty well and I started getting scouted by other colleges. I didn't go back and I and I kind of Just took to the streets a little bit and and was selling drugs and making music and drawing and writing and stuff like that and that's kind of like what I did for a little while.
Phill 38:10
Yeah man that was like I think a big transition for a lot of us yeah 'cause I think the same same time like your family had issues. My family not well my parents had been divorced for a long time but you know, I was living with my father and then shit kind of hit the fan around the same time but the the calm before the storm before that happened we did so much I think growing it's growing together man like I just wanted to say thank you man like when I was you know going through shit with with my family like going to you know your house- your mom's house and stuff you know going in your room and like talking about you know, like this kind of story that that you had and making characters. And like that elf book that you had to remember that book?
Adam 39:01
Yeah, I remember that.
Phill 39:02
Yeah, man. So I just want to say thank you for that, man like that. That really helped me deal with a lot of stuff. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, but thanks, man. But yeah, man around that time, man, I think you know, we also were able to go see Amano in Manhattan.
Adam 39:22
You know what's weird about that, man? I wasn't there for that. Oh, you know, all of the all of the guys in our friend group went except for me. And the reason why was because at that time, I was trying to do acting still, because I had just finished doing theater. And I didn't know what to do with my life. So, you know, they were like, "You got to go on auditions. You got to just put on the pavement and you got to put in that work." And this hustlers mentality kind of took over me for a short time to try to make it in this field and I remember skipping out on meeting basically the guy who- that my art style was inspired by to try to make it to this audition. And I regretted it. That's one of the I don't really regret much in my life but well, that's one of the things that if I could go back and undo that, I would undo that I would not go to that audition and I would have just gone with you guys to see Amano, because that was one of his only appearances in the United States and if there's any artist on earth who style resembles my style and that I could have sort of had a poignant moment meeting it would have been Amano and so I remember that and a lot of you guys remember me there
Phill 40:44
Yeah,
Adam 40:44
but I wasn't there.
Phill 40:45
It was like a Berenstain Bear moment, man.
Adam 40:47
It's a Berenstain Bear moment, bro. And it makes me upset and it's crazy because shortly after that, a lot of auditions that I went on. It's a memory that I kind of repressed or put away. Or maybe maybe I didn't really even think it was that important at the time. So it didn't stick out. But now that we're going through all of the sort of civil rights and racial tensions that we're going through now, where things are coming up on the surface that have always been there. I remember most of the auditions I went on, you know, my, my, my headshot was black and white. And when I would show up, they, most of the time, I didn't get the part because they said, I look white. Yeah, they didn't that I didn't look white. So I, I was like, Oh, I remember being embarrassed for myself, you know, being ashamed that I didn't look white enough because of course, I didn't really get accepted with people of color either. You know, a lot of Latinos didn't accept me because I wasn't very culturally Latino. You know, I'm part black, but I'm not accepted in any groups of black people. Because they just see me as the lucky one that's light skinned who doesn't give a Yeah, yeah. You know, does And get get to face as much, you know, racism as they do. And then with white people, they're just like, you're not white, you're this. You're not what you are pretending to be. But I'm not pretending to be anything. I'm just being myself. So that was one of the times where I realized that I didn't fit in being multiracial on the way that I am and I don't fit into any group really, unless I sort of really embraced being colonialist Puerto Rican, because I am very Puerto Rican in terms of my, my, my own feelings, but it's straight up through the indigenous aspect of my family's culture. You know, my family's very indigenous, and they have a lot of dyno customs and I and I resonate with that. But even if I do that, it's lost on most Puerto Ricans because most Puerto Ricans don't feel indigenous, they feel Puerto Rican and that means exactly whatever they think it means or whatever those stereotypes may be, which is you know, rice and beans and salsa music and you know, it's not go with something mofongo and, you know, you know, getting pregnant early and having Puerto Rican twins and all this bullshit that goes along with stereotypical Puerto Rican you know, beliefs, but our beliefs about Puerto Ricans, but my own my own personal identification with Puerto Rico comes from my Taíno culture and like my great grandfather and the stories that I was told about how they survived in the mountains there after colonization, so I never felt like I belonged anywhere. And I realized that when I started trying to be part of this, you know, very shallow field of entertainment, that I didn't want to I didn't want to be part of it. So, I kind of broke away from that.
Phill 43:48
Alright, so, boom. You know, we, we are at, you know, that time in our lives, you know, we went to the raves. We, you know, we're like bouncing around trying to figure out our place and then, you know, I think obviously so you got really into music when the acting thing didn't fall into place
Adam 44:17
Yeah
Phill 44:17
Yeah, so what propelled you? That I remember like we- you know and that like inspired me, man, because I remember like you you got like the Fruity Loops program I think. You had- you moved your room to your sister's room it was the smaller room and I remember like you had the computer and like you know I think your, you know, you're abula I was still, you know, alive and I remember that like this your house for me was such a nice place to be, man. I didn't have anywhere to go. So, I really appreciated being over your house all the time.
Adam 44:50
I loved having you there because you you you were one of the few people that could understand what I was doing. You know, if I was working on stories, if I was working on beats like you were there with me for those things. And, of course, we worked on music together from high school to adulthood. I mean, probably the last track that we did together was maybe last year or something. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Music 45:12
Adam Maria/Manny Marx (Orbit of the Underworld)
Adam 45:50
So, yeah, that just making beats man, just realizing that I didn't- I missed out on a lot of learning how to play any instruments and then I realized that I could use programs and start programming, sampling things and stealing stuff from soundtracks and putting the drums underneath them and developing from there. I really fell in love with that. Doing some of the multimedia work that I did like the animatic- the Circle of Agony thing that we worked- that you were actually making music for it and not just doing the art and the story but making the music and then doing the soundtrack for it and the score. Just music was just another part of me being able to art direct my life, you know, it's been a blessing. It's been such a great part of my life.
Phill 47:02
Yeah, man, and you've done you know, you know we've talked for almost an hour but uh, you know, there's so much I think between you know, you starting music, right? Because I think that is when you know, like the T-shirts remember with like, you know, making like the illustrations, like you- the L'nore story, then music then this is like the whole Mage the Midknight thing that was kind of inspired by your story then, you know, making beats and then all of a fucking sudden man you're painting.
Adam 47:43
Yeah, I forgot about that.
Phill 47:45
So what happened with this, dude?
Adam 47:49
I don't know, I think I just- I have this weird thing that when I was little, I thought that if I decided to be good at something thing that I would just happen. And I didn't really believe in that for a long time after the world sort of disappointed me a little bit, when I kind of went out as an adult, I kind of felt like I was good at nothing, and that I would be nothing. So once you know, I had my son, you know, I had a child very early and he's 15 now, in raising him, I realized that being encouraging and just experimenting is really healthy and and and, and it doesn't matter what the outcome is. So I started to like, kind of get confidence in doing a little bit more of what I historically I didn't think I could do. So, I think I just thought I liked the idea of painting and I said, "Well, that looks like fun and and maybe I can try it. And if I tie it all into this world that I've built-" you know, everything that I do is tied into that whether it's the music that I made, or more the little toys that I made or, or drawings or stories, they're all tied into this world building idea. And once I tied it into that, it sort of became kind of easy for me. I just sort of let it be whatever it is and accepted it for what it was and gave all my paintings away and some people started to like them so, so I felt good I felt good about it. You know, I felt good about the whole process.
Phill 49:18
Yeah, man, it's just Yeah, dude just this is so cool man. like yeah, this match funny man because I'm like your L'nore mythos whatever is like my favorite book that is- doesn't-
Phill 49:32
That's not written.
Phill 49:34
That never been written. It's just, it's all in your head, man.
Adam 49:37
It's all there. It's still it's still there, man. I'm still working on it.
Adam 49:41
Yeah,
Adam 49:42
You know, one day I'll share with you what I have but one of the problems- it's not a problem--I'm not gonna say it's a problem. But one of the challenges or realities that I have to face is that I do these things now. For purely for the enjoyment that I get out of doing them. Then it doesn't need to go any further than that. Like I don't have to share any of this stuff with anybody in order for it to serve its purpose in my life and for it to bring me that much joy. So I worked on it since then I've never stopped and it's become something deeper and more complex and a little bit less one to one, like maybe it's a little bit more allegorical. Now a little bit more abstract and, you know, intertwined with all of the other work that I do.
Adam 50:31
Yeah.
Adam 50:32
So, you know, it's involved with the Circle of Agony with all of the music that I made, you know, it's all connected. But yeah, it's all still there and I'm hoping to share it a little bit just so that anyone who was curious about what I've been working on in my life, can look at it if they want to and see how it's developed because I don't make my money off of this stuff. I don't have to put anything out. There's no pressure for me to produce I just uh i just muse on it and work on it in different forms and then I my job- my actual work is so different from that there's no pressure for me to have to share it.
Phill 51:17
Yeah man, yeah awesome thanks for thanks for sharing man so, yeah man, like you know just you've done so much artistically so much you know create creatively that's kind of been an inspiration for my whole life and then all of a sudden man you know this is not what you do man this is you you you did not pursue anything in the arts so to speak. So yeah would you mind sharing about, you know, what you're doing now?
Adam 51:50
Yeah, sure. Right now I'm in school for my MSW which is my Master's in Social Work, which I should be getting in in another couple of years, but I'm already working on clinical teams as an MSW student. So I'm basically doing therapy. And I do- the funny thing is the first thing that you said was you knew me as the guy who does, who does kung fu and can draw good and that's like what I do at my job now. I see patients, you know, who have mental health challenges and I do appointments with them where we do Qigong together, which is, you know, ancient Chinese meditative art healing arts that I learned in kung fu and, and art and I do art with them and sort of explore the spiritual aspect of their healing process. through some of the art that I know including the martial arts, because I'm I am looking at it in a more holistic way. I am looking at it in a more an experiential way when we have a challenge when we feel down about ourselves when we're feeling lost, which I have many times in my life and I think that was the beginning of my curiosity towards what the human experience is what it's like to have a consciousness what it's that unique, singular experience of one person one being, you know, one human being, their conscious experience is unique in all of history. Not a single human being in history that ever existed or ever will exist will have the same conscious setup as this one person, any one person. So, when you get to know someone, when you get to know yourself, you're getting to know just a completely one in a billion, 1 in a trillion.
Adam 53:48
Yeah, infinit.
Adam 53:48
Yeah, one in infinitum of a configuration of self-awareness. And I just think that that is so beautiful, and so awe inspiring. And when someone is in pain when I know that someone is suffering, I know that there is a way to interface and interact with this person so that movement happens, some kind of movement happens and it may not be in the way that anybody thinks because everybody is so unique. And I think that that's the new place that I'd like to explore. My you know, creativity and my imagination is in interfacing with the consciousness of another person and with my own with my own consciousness, and how does my consciousness and let's say yours, come together to create a reality that only we could understand? Like, for example, like you said, the music from the media room, projects that we did to the stories that we've been a part of and written, to the performances we did on stage together, to you being part of my fiction writing, and us making music together and then you being a voice actor and a character in my world with us and then the possibility that we are going to maybe write a book together about the umwelt and about the conscious experience of a singular organism, the consciousness and the the awareness, the life-force that you and I share is a unique universe that no one will be able to fully comprehend not even us, not even you and I, and the people with the two closest front seats to that whole experience is you and I, and we are lucky enough that we get to talk about it whenever we want. We get to explore that universe whenever we want, which is just our friendship, basically.
Phill 56:49
Yeah, yeah, man. Yeah.
Adam 56:50
And and, and, you know, you are obviously aware of it this whole, this whole podcast, this whole interview, is part of that- is part of that. And, you know, I think that that's where I'm going next and obviously you're kind of coming with me whether you like it or not. We talk about this shit all the time
Phill 57:07
All the time. Yeah.
Adam 57:08
What we can do you know, the the frontiers are- I don't look at it as like space or the ocean or something like that. I don't look at it like that. I think that the ultimate infinite frontier is our consciousness and our ability to create and our imagination and that's, that's where I'm going.
Phill 57:29
Dope man. Yeah, man. Thanks, dude. Thanks. Thanks for sharing, man. I mean, um, yeah, definitely can relate to what you're talking about. I mean, you know, yeah, I would love more than anything to to be a social worker. This is what I would have done. If I didn't come to Japan. You know, I was I was applying to the MSW program at Stony Brook. Because, you know, I just- for me, it's like the ultimate job. So it's so cool that that you're pursuing that and yeah, man, so, you know, hats off to you for, for doing this it's somewhat of a thankless job; a lot of a lot of work was into it, but not a lot of not a lot of people, you know, give props to social workers, man, but for me, it's the ultimate job. But um, you know, I got into education and it's kind of, you know, my- I just like education because, you know, I think there are elements of, of Social Work- language, language learning in particular, something I found really interesting because people's identity changes, you know, when they begin to learn a new language because it kind of opens up a new world to you, you know what I mean? Yeah. So, yeah, and that's what, that's what has made me interested in, you know, about learning, and specifically language-learning later in life, you know, because it's not it's not it's not easy.
Adam 59:00
I mean, after I think age seven or eight, it's it becomes increasingly difficult to learn a language.
Phill 59:06
language you know, second SLA second, language acquisition and stuff like you know, it's really deep interesting field. But what we're learning now in the field is that it's about emotion man about like out like the affective factors man, like, you know, like it's about it is holistic, like learning a language effectively and teaching language effectively. It's about what well being and about, you know, being in the right place, mentally understanding who you are and your values. And you can use those things to learn better. But it's not a good word, but more effectively. You know, if you're not invested in it, or you don't see the purpose of learning a language, then you're not going to learn as effectively but if you can connect it to your beliefs, your goals, your dreams, then this can, you know, motivate you and inspire you to learn in a more, you know, positive and effective way. So, yeah, man, you know, I think, you know, there are lots of crossovers between learning and between, you know, mental health and and in social work, as you said, it's the final frontier, right? The consciousness is kind of something that I think you and I were drawn to from different directions, but we kind of ended up in the same spot with empathy, right? It's like, so about being empathetic and about, you know, the unfiltered understanding people's perspectives and stuff. So, yeah, man, it's cool that we ended up here.
Adam 1:00:36
teachers like in my life have been- I didn't know anything about source of social work or therapy or anything like that. But the few teachers in my life that cared about me- that showed me that they cared, you know, when I was lacking, kind of like an inspirational adult guidance. Were the ones who did exactly what I'm saying. thing to do now, which is really to help guide people during moments of their life where they feel sort of rudderless and and and movement for them is not happening. I don't really necessarily believe you can heal people I I believe you can help them heal themselves and you can walk with them sort of parallel with them and help guide them and be sort of a, a sort of Saint for them in that moment. There's like a really good movie that I like, called a guide to recognizing your saints and I think shyla boof is in it. Robert Downey Jr. and it's about recognizing the people in your life that sort of represent- their like totems of a certain idea, and a certain shift in your life. And I think that social workers can be like that, and teachers can be like that as well. So, you know, representing a certain shift in a paradigm in someone's life and then they'll look back on that moment. And if you can be aware in the moment and sort of see when somebody's having a shift and be instrumental in guiding them through that shift. That's an important job to have. And that could be anything you know, it could be a guidance counselor, it could be a have to school counselor, it could be a teacher, it could be a social worker. It could be just a dude in your hood down the block. But I guess you know, me recognizing what that is. I'm trying to optimize my my my ability to be in that position for other people.
Phill 1:01:11
Dope man. we am and thanks for sharing so much. Yeah, dude, it's just so nice to catch up and yeah, man just talking to you, man. I keep on just thinking about like, like vampires and shit.
Adam 1:02:47
For like, 20 hours.
Phill 1:02:50
Oh man.
Adam 1:02:51
There are so many things and even just like the dating, you know, are dealing with you know, the female the fairer sex.
Adam 1:03:03
Just so many things, bro...
Phill 1:03:04
Yeah, but yeah, man. Thanks, dude. Um, so so yeah, man, we've talked a little bit over an hour. And yeah, I just wanted to just touch on one or two more things. So you shared really cool photo with me about a piece of jewelry that you made one of your coworkers that's like, tie into, you know, inspired. So, yeah, can you share a little bit about like, what what you've learned about the title culture and, you know, something that, you know, just to just to preface, I recently, my aunt gave me a book. I think the book title is called the war against all Puerto Ricans, written by Scott I think, Nelson Dennis. And it just talks about the colonial history of Puerto Rico and just like you know, I after after reading that book- some party going on.
Adam 1:04:03
I know, it's just some large speakers.
Phill 1:04:04
It's so good. So, yeah, this reading that book, and then I was just some- So yeah, if you can just like, you know, you can expand upon this or give your own opinion or insight what you've learned. But like Puerto Rican history is so deep and so interesting. And, you know, it- what blows my mind today is that not many Puerto Ricans know a lot about or even seem to care about, you know, the US and what the US has done to Puerto Rico over the past, you know, 100 years. So, one thing that I remember is my great-grandmother, you know, like she was this like, would drink these herbs and just have this way about her that I just didn't really connect beacuse I didn't know too much about like the, the native culture of Puerto Rico but in retrospect, yeah man, like, you know, there was lots of native beliefs and stuff and even like a religious thing religiously. These kind of different spiritual beliefs, different way of interacting with people- I mean she watched novellas and stuff, you know what I mean, but um, you know, it was just different man. And yeah, man. So what have you learned? about, you know, your Puerto Rican heritage in the Taíno people and stuff?
Adam 1:05:24
Yeah, well, I think I started to feel the the lack of culture and identity in myself. Recently, fairly recently, as I started really exploring my own spirituality, and my relationship with healing and therapy, and what I'm doing with some of the clients that I'm with, and I explored a little bit of my own background and I learned a lot about my family. And then I started exploring Taíno culture and what happened to us there. And what I learned, of course, some people know some of these things. Some people don't but, you know, first of all the Taíno people are not their name- They're not dying. They're the first thing that they said was that we're Taínos and that means that we're good people. So they were trying to tell the Spanish there Who were you, we're good. Don't worry about us. We're good. We're good people. We're like kind and we're, we're good. And so that's what they were saying. So when they're calling themselves Taíno, they're saying, don't be afraid of us because we're good and we were just natives of Boriquén. So we would be like, Boriqua. That's exactly what we are, you know.
Adam 1:06:50
And my family grew up for many, many, many generations. Back to on uncountable generations in Jaco which is where Agüeybaná, the chief of all of Puerto Rico escape, you know, lived and escaped to in the mountains when the sort of war broke out between the Spanish and the Taíno my family is mostly all genetically, culturally, every- any way you want to look at it indigenous, and they live in the mountains, there in that same place where those natives ran for cover. So I learned that how deep my history is, with that- the occurrences of the violence of colonialism. And then some of the old stories that they would tell and some of the things that they would do started to come back to me and I would compare it to what I learned of dyno culture. And I realized that my family has basically been practicing indigenous Taino culture, for forever non-stop to this day even. And I realized that we were the first to interface with European forces. We were the first to experience genocide and that Puerto Rican and Dominican and Cuban culture is completely entrenched with terrible, genocidal trauma, slavery, patriarchy, colonialism through I mean- capitalism through colonialism, because you know, those things are, are not- you know, they're interchangeable. They're not separable.
Phill 1:08:37
Yep.
Adam 1:08:38
And how much of our current day understanding of indigenous cultures and some words that we use and some things that we do, especially Latinos- Caribbean Latinos, comes from Taíno culture, you know, like, hammocks. Hammocks were invented by the Taíno. Barbecues is a Taíno word and that was, but all barbecues when somebody has a barbecue, you know, Korean barbecue, American barbecue, any barbecue at all, the idea of a barbecue- A barbecue is the word and the ceremony for cooking meat outside with people under a flame and that's a Tíano ritual. And so my coworker who was having sort of the same crisis now that I was having a couple of years ago really wanted to connect to her identity. So a part of that, for me is you know, she's the was the only Puerto Rican- the only person of color working at the company that I work for, and she asked them to hire someone of color and they happen to hire me. So there's sort of like a serendipitous, I say, you know, quality to me being hired and finding and me being as awakened as I was in that moment, to my own culture. And so I'm always giving her what I learned and, and the sort of the art that I make with feathers and using macaw feathers to make jewelry and stuff the way that my- our ancestors did, and giving them to her and I bought her a drum- a hand drum to play. And I want to just help her connect with her ancestors, the way that I have, you know, I believe that generational trauma is real. And I think that if there is a way to look at the conscious perspective in a metaphysical way of- outside of time, extra temporal, you know, consciousness, that there is a way to look at all of this as happening at the same time and that if our family members down the generational lines either before us or after us would would want us- for any- want for us if anything, it would be that we find some sort of peace with ourselves and do our work do our part of the work in untangling some of the damage done by colonization and by trauma, generational trauma of inequality and, and exploiting human beings and that's what I think I'm trying to do. I think that in being aware of what has happened to, you know, my grandfather and my great grandfather and my great great grandfather and what- how that affects me and how that affects my son. And how I'm going to address that is the way that I am being aware of my ancestors and and sort of being a good Taíno and helping to heal the hurts that were enacted upon us, you know.
Phill 1:11:47
Yeah, man. I mean, it's just weird. You know, this is great to hear you say that just, you know, not to get too off topic, but, you know, I don't get in trouble here. Um, you know, I just kind of feel like- I kind of feel that, that trauma, and we can go into like there's all this theory and stuff about like, post colonialism and stuff, but I mean, just basically, you know, reclaiming that identity and that history is so important. I feel, you know, every time I try to have this conversation with other people who are Puerto Rican, they don't want to have it or, you know, that is kind of like, you know, you know, like, very defeated, but I think after learning the history, and just, especially what the United States did to Puerto Rico, it's understandable, like the Ponce massacre, and all this stuff, like just crazy stuff. So, yeah, it is it is a thing and I think, you know, yeah, it's dope, that you, you know, are, you know, able to, you know, to learn more and share these things. I think it's really important for me, and I hope you continue doing it, man.
Adam 1:12:53
Yeah, I think it's important to and I and what I do realize, or at least I try to remind myself is that you can't know what you don't know. You can't see what you're incapable of seeing. So yeah, I try not to hold it against anybody for being colonized because they don't believe that they're colonized. This is just the water this is the fish in the water. Yeah, the fish doesn't say that they're in water. The fish is just living its life. It doesn't understand that there is water and that there is not water. And the first step in meaning and understanding some of these concepts was taking classes like take- doing what was it a seminar online of decolonization and sort of understanding that things concepts that even you have introduced me to like the WEIRD you know, the Western, Educated, Industrialized, Rich, Democratic perspective.
Phill 1:13:49
Yeah.
Adam 1:13:47
We don't even realize that. We're preferring certain perspectives like for example, research-based so you know, everything I do with my clients is not researched based because the validity of Qi Gong is 4000 years of culture, not research. There's no research in Qi Gong and the only research done on Qi Gong is done by white people in the- academics who want to get permission by other white people in academics to say that Qi Gong is relevant, but no Chinese person living in rural China practicing thousands of year old styles of Qi Gong.
Adam 1:14:06
They're still alive.
Adam 1:14:40
Yeah, they don't give a shit about you know what a white person thinks about Qi Gong or how much evidence based data they have to back up the usage of it in a clinical setting. So, even just understanding that my perspective as a human being, and all of the things that lead up to my perspective, including my Taíno culture, including my creation of semies, which is like little little totems that I give to my friends, and their toys, you know, they look like toys. But I've been doing that my whole life without even knowing giving the sort of spiritual items that represent a concept that's supposed to supplement your- the energy, the conscious energy that you that you are working with on a daily basis. That is a purely spiritual, Taíno, concept. And there is no, you know, there's no data backup that what I'm doing is even applicable to my situation, but because I know that because I know that these aren't just perspectives, I can vouch for myself; I can speak for myself and push for people to be aware of things that they weren't aware of before. So I may not have let's say data to back up why taking into consideration the spiritual aspect of Qi Gong or even just being a human being is important. But I'm not going to back down on my belief that these ideas are important just because they are not framed in a Western- in a way that a person with authority in a Western culture can understand so they're satisfied, I don't have to satisfy any particular person in a in a power dynamic. If I stick to the the these high level sort of concepts of basically making valid every human experience and making valid non-Western experiences, especially cultures that have been developing for thousands and thousands of years successfully before colonization, you know, yeah, would like, you know, we can we can talk all day about the merits of capitalism, but capitalism has only been around for at most 500 years, we have with an extremely, extremely mixed results and a rocky history. But what about the thousands of years that came before out of indigenous lifestyle in the Americas? You know, so there is an argument for everything and now I'm starting to realize that I don't have to feel penned in or I don't I don't have to feel like I don't belong, or that my perspective is not important.
Phill 1:17:25
Yeah, man.Thanks, man. Thanks. Thanks for thanks for sharing man. Yeah. I agree with you man. I mean, being holistic you know thinking about well being you know, thinking about you know, emotion and I think this is something that, I have my theories, but um, you know, kind of this kind of emotional importance of, you know, who- we are our identity giving these these totems, these kind of sentimental things, right? They will- have been downplayed, and they, you know, "Oh, you can't measure it", you know, that "therefore, it's pointless." You know what I'm saying like- I have to do the reading. But um, you know, I think it is a part about the colonialists mindset and this Eurocentric mindset about, you know, measuring everything and making- like, if it doesn't produce results, then it's pointless. You know, it's interesting and new way of looking at the world very, despiritualized way of looking at the world, you know, like-
Adam 1:18:21
Very material, you know, the "Western civilization" is very materialistic. It's about tangible things. It's about tangible objects. It's about tangible wealth. It's about measurable outcomes. And all of these things are tied to the physical world in a way that doesn't allow the space for the non-tangible which includes the nebulous, unmeasurable aspects of our consciousness. It makes no room at all for anything supernatural or spiritual- matters of faith, imagination, emotions like love, they're very difficult to pin down with that way of thinking. And so it's cutting out so much of what being a human being really is. The reality of being a human being is so entrenched, irreversibly entrenched in ideas like non-materialism, that finally now we're starting to see, you know that capitalism is not necessarily the the way that's gonna lead us into the future, that colonialism was never something that was justifiable by any real humanitarian ideas, and that non-Western cultures and ideas are just as important as Western and that non-materialism and spirituality as a way of exploring the human experience is going to be the way that we understand who we are better than we did before, what we're capable of, and what we need to do next. And it's only now starting to dawn on the people who have been living very narrow lifestyles, what is- what else is out there for them.
Phill 1:20:16
Yeah, man, it's yeah, it's like, yeah, the ritual is as important man, I mean, people just didn't do rituals, because, you know, they just want it to be silly, you know, like, some- that developed over thousands and thousands of years. And it's funny that you mentioned capitalism. It's like, "Yo, like, humans lived perfectly fine for like thousands of 10s of thousands of years", right? And then, you know, introduce capitalism and we're about to, like, kill ourselves in the span of like, 100.
Adam 1:20:50
Yeah, it's unsustainable, but I mean the people who benefit the most out of capitalism are absolutely in no rush to change that. You know, when you when you have a good deal going, you don't? You don't want to shut it down, of course not. So it makes perfect sense that the people who are benefiting the most out of capitalism are trying to do everything and say everything in their power to convince us that it's not as bad.
Phill 1:21:21
"It's the only way"
Adam 1:21:21
That it is the only way and it's a trick, you know, it's a trick but the good thing about the truth is that you can fight all you want and the truth is going to be there when everything else erodes, so yeah, it's gonna be what it is either the hard way or the easy way and I don't think human beings learned the full lesson unless we learn it the hard way.
Phill 1:21:48
Yeah, that's a- yeah man. Definitely. But man, thanks so much. I don't know how much I'll be able to keep- we've been talking like an hour and a half. I might make that a side thing.
Adam 1:22:01
It's all good man.
Phill 1:22:01
So yeah, but you know, it's not a job- it's just my project so yeah, but thanks for sharing so much so yeah, the final question man. Yeah, man, I mean, I know the answer, but can you speak any other languages? Even a few words other than English? Please share.
Phill 1:22:16
I can speak a little bit of Spanish, of course. I could say- What can I say? Tengo que practical mi español difcíil porque yo no tengo mi abuela y no conozco ningun abuelita con yo puedo practical. Basically I just said I can speak-
Phill 1:22:39
Let me guess so you can speak Spanish you can speak some Spanish but you know it's like very basic and like very practical Spanish and it's very difficult because your grandmother, something grandmother and then I'm gone.
Adam 1:23:00
It's pretty close. I said, "I need to practice my Spanish but it's difficult because I don't have a grandma anymore. And I don't know any grandmas on my block with whom I can practice Spanish" because it's always good to practice Spanish with an abuelita.
Phill 1:23:17
Yeah, man. I was talking with Annie 'cause yeah Annie she studied in Puerto Rico for a year in college.
Phill 1:23:25
That's dope.
Phill 1:23:26
Yeah, yeah. And I was telling her like, yeah, "I'm really good. I getting yelled in his Spanish" like callate, sentate, ven aquí" So yeah, I'm a pro at getting yelled at in Spanish, but I can't really speak it too much.
Adam 1:23:40
It's all good. I mean, like, if you- if you're allowing yourself to be yelled at by a woman in Spanish, then you got half of being Puerto Rican down.
Phill 1:23:48
Oh man. Yeah, thanks, dude. I really appreciate it, man. And yeah, man. I hope to have you back on and yeah, we can definitely get into it about the umwelt and about colonialism and
Adam 1:24:03
More projects, more work happening.
Adam 1:24:06
Yeah, man. All right, thanks dude.
Adam 1:24:09
Yeah, we'll talk.
Music 1:24:42
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